Sydney_Iron
11:10 Mon Feb 23
Re: Two Australian Citizens About to be Executed in Indonesia
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This short video shows just how wrong most people's beliefs about drugs are.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PxmvFRtYuYQ#t=417
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Joke Whole
1:30 Sun Feb 22
Re: Two Australian Citizens About to be Executed in Indonesia
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"trousered the sash"???
That should read "trousered the CASH".
"Trousered the Sash" is, as everybody knows, a late 16th century village folk (Morris) dance, prohibited through the imposition of local by-laws across most of England upon the ascension of Queen Victoria on account, it's said, of her dislike of it's "masonic overtones".
Trousered the CASH
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Joke Whole
1:13 Sun Feb 22
Re: Two Australian Citizens About to be Executed in Indonesia
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As drug production is such a large part of the economy in certain parts of the world, and, coincidentally, the administrations are "influenced", it would make sense for them to openly embrace such a cash cow and bring the money - at least partially - out in the open.
They should then openly sell whatever is produced to anybody who wishes to take said produce out of the country and not hinder them once they've trousered the sash.
A clear and unambiguous notification to the destination of said purchaser and his cargo should then be sent and it is then up to the receiving country as to what to do: let the drugs in to do their damage or detain & destroy.
The problem is 100% in the country of consumption, so it's really there that most effort should be directed (if it can't be got from, say, Indonesia then any of a dozen other sources is perfectly acceptable to the in-country users & distributors).
If it's detain & destroy, it won't take long for any importing/consuming country to realise that the net result is a flight of capital for no return, which does nothing to help balance a country's books.
So it requires a plesi-coordinated set of actions from world governments: one managing supply and the other demand. A few countries will need to do both.
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Silas Greenback
12:47 Sun Feb 22
Re: Two Australian Citizens About to be Executed in Indonesia
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Just having visited Indonesia many times and seeing the amount of drugs their local youth do consume...it's clear that supply in the country isn't an issue. There was a particularly debaucherous night club in Jakarta called Stadium (closed early this year) where anything was available openly (but there are many other clubs like that) and the rumour was that it was the son of one of the Indonesian military generals who controlled the majority of supply of drugs in Jakarta.
Indonesia is a large producer of MDMA and methamphetamines as so many of the raw materials used in its production are available there, and the army is always reputed to be involved.
So I think there is political pressure to keep the executions on in Indonesia not so much as a deterrent, but to just send a message to any foreign traffickers to stay out of the market and leave it to the well entrenched locals. This probably applies more to Java / Sumatra though rather than Bali .
Singapore just arrested a guy last month with heroin on him while on transit to Indonesia and he might be executed as Singapore resumed drug related executions in 2014 after a 3 year gap, when two locals were hanged. That is particularly harsh as he wasn't even planning to exit the airport in Singapore.
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Joke Whole
11:48 Sun Feb 22
Re: Two Australian Citizens About to be Executed in Indonesia
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two things that can be the biggest help in this area are education, to which some previous posters have already alluded, and giving people a purpose in life (and I don't mean being part of some organised religion, although I've met very few pissed and/or stoned monks out here in this part of Asia).
"The devil", as the saying goes, can always find work for idle hands.
Education, although the correct way, will by it's very nature, take at least one generation, maybe two, to work it's way through society at all levels. People - and especially politicians with elections to win - simply are not prepared to wait that long, and so the much simpler and definitely more media-attractive "be seen to be doing something", capital punishment is deployed.
Does it deter? It probably would if the chances of actually being caught in the first place AND trial to verdict was initiated very quickly (without threat to truth or justice).
If you're going to use the dog of fear, you'd better make sure it's teeth are sharp and it's belly empty.
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side effect
11:06 Sun Feb 22
Re: Two Australian Citizens About to be Executed in Indonesia
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Im not for the death penalty myself. Would not want to be responsible fot the death off anyone.
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Westham67
3:12 Sun Feb 22
Re: Two Australian Citizens About to be Executed in Indonesia
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side effect 12:26 Sun Feb 22
What does killing them achieve and i mean world drug supply wise
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Sydney_Iron
3:06 Sun Feb 22
Re: Two Australian Citizens About to be Executed in Indonesia
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Not looking good for these 2 now
http://www.smh.com.au/world/joko-widodo-says-execution-of-bali-nine-pair-andrew-chan-and-myuran-sukumaran-will-not-be-delayed-20150220-13kulo.html
Indonesian President Joko Widodo says there has been no delay in plans to execute Australians Andrew Chan and Myuran Sukumaran, despite the postponement this week of their transfer to the island where they are slated to be killed.
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side effect
12:26 Sun Feb 22
Re: Two Australian Citizens About to be Executed in Indonesia
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Pushers would just bully nice innocent people to do their work for them
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Westham67
11:37 Sat Feb 21
Re: Two Australian Citizens About to be Executed in Indonesia
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Braino
Sorry to here that mate , Ive had a few mates in my younger days die from this terrible epidemic a couple of ODs in their early 20s and a good friend who killed himself on his 19th Birthday
i think killing the traffickers is a way of "Shooting the messenger" so to speak. The entire might of the US could not beat of even seriously impact on the drug supply to a serious degree in "The War on Drugs"
Education and rehabilitation I believe is the only way to save the people addicted and stop those temped . Killing drug traffickers will not help them IMO
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Briano
12:13 Sat Feb 21
Re: Two Australian Citizens About to be Executed in Indonesia
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There is a view that only a barbaric society can impose this form of punishment but having a heroin addict as a family member I can understand the reasoning, due to misery caused not only to me, but probably 30, 40 or maybe 50 other people.
If you are stupid or greedy enough to peddle the poison you deserve all you get.
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bishbosh
3:38 Fri Feb 20
Re: Two Australian Citizens About to be Executed in Indonesia
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Bali is beautiful ive been so many times Seminyak, Ubud deep in the forest a bit higher it is cooler with the rice fields and the famous babi guling and bebek begil restuarants, monkey forest, Dreamland, karma beach etc but kuta is the main strip full of mainly pissed up Aussies who IMO are worse than us brits in the meds. it is a tiny chunk of Bali come away from kuta the rest of Bali is beautiful.
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Coffee
7:50 Fri Feb 20
Re: Two Australian Citizens About to be Executed in Indonesia
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I had the misfortune of going through it many years ago. That was enough. There are many wonderful towns and villages along that whole coastline and inland.
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Private Dancer
7:28 Fri Feb 20
Re: Two Australian Citizens About to be Executed in Indonesia
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Coffee - I'm sure you're right, but I wouldn't have minded seeing the shithole once.
Have you been there yourself?
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Coffee
7:09 Fri Feb 20
Re: Two Australian Citizens About to be Executed in Indonesia
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Private Dancer 5:36 Fri Feb 20
Unnecessary niggle.
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Westham67
5:45 Fri Feb 20
Re: Two Australian Citizens About to be Executed in Indonesia
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its the Aussie Benidorm , you see all your mates from the social security office
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eric5bellies
5:37 Fri Feb 20
Re: Two Australian Citizens About to be Executed in Indonesia
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Comparing Bali to Benidorm is a bit like comparing Coronation street WITH Baywatch
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Private Dancer
5:36 Fri Feb 20
Re: Two Australian Citizens About to be Executed in Indonesia
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Must admit it has always niggled me that I never went. That's one down side of being over here, you no longer have the whole of Europe on your doorstep for weekends away, I've missed many lads weekends away, stag do's, birthdays, etc..
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Sydney_Iron
5:32 Fri Feb 20
Re: Two Australian Citizens About to be Executed in Indonesia
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Benidorm is fantastic, if…………………….your early to mid 20,s would imagine it would do the head in of your average 40 something.
Rather go to Clacton as well, and have a nice cup of tea in a deck chair
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balders
5:25 Fri Feb 20
Re: Two Australian Citizens About to be Executed in Indonesia
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Still rate Clacton better than Benidorm and better gear :-0
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Westham67
5:08 Fri Feb 20
Re: Two Australian Citizens About to be Executed in Indonesia
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NOT BEEN TO BENIDORM ??
You haven't lived mate
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